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How will you deal [later] with people in your life who [now] refuse to listen?
I've recently come to realize that perhaps the biggest challenge we will face as individuals is not how we prepare ourselves and our immediate families for what is coming, but how we will eventually deal with the people in our lives who we have reached out to but who refuse to take seriously the warnings of the Crash Course.
To illustrate my point, see if this sounds familiar: You have people in your life who you care about. Close friends and your extended family, inlaws and so forth. You have tried to reach out to them and call their attention to the Crash Course, and perhaps you even spent some of your own money to buy the DVD version to give them as a gift this past holiday season.
But they refuse to listen or take you seriously. Some of them are even so rude as to roll their eyes and refer to Chris Martenson as a "crackpot" or to the Crash Course as senseless propaganda. They remain anxious for President Obama to "hurry up and fix the credit system" because they have been "suffering" for nearly three years now with the 5-series BMW they bought on easy borrowed money, and they very much want to trade it in for a new 7-series but they can't because "the system is broken".
Of course even the 5-series was well beyond their means but they don't see it that way, and feel that the world owes them a credit system that allows them to live well beyond their means on borrowed money. Sound familiar? Now fast-forward 10 years. It's 2019 and the family in question still has the 5-series BMW. In fact, they are now living in it because they lost their home, and it's the only source of shelter they can find. Gas is either unavailable or prohibitively expensive, so it is no longer a viable means of transportation.
Meanwhile, you were diligent and prepared yourself and your immediate family as well as you could. Your modest savings were put in gold and silver in physical bullion form, which has appreciated in real value considerably as the fiat monetary system collapsed. You are living a much harder life than you had before the big crash of the twenty-teens, but you're getting by. Now these people are at your doorstep, and the guilt trip is huge. PLEASE help us!!! Look at our poor starving children! You are now "rich" in their eyes, and the 5-yr old has tears in her eyes because her parents have described you as her "rich Uncle" who was so "selfish" back in the early stages of the crash that you didn't "participate in saving the economy" by spending money you didn't have on credit.
Because of your "greed", you now have much more than they do, and they are begging you to share what precious food, shelter and supplies you have with them. What do you do? What do you tell the crying 5-yr old? I'm already encountering people who have lived way beyond their means on borrowed money starting to expect me to bail them out because I am more financially comfortable than they are, and it's "obviously" the responsible thing for me to do. In their eyes.
For now, I have no problem telling them that they need to accept accountability for situations of their own making. But the vision of a toddler some day not understanding why a "greedy" person like myself doesn't think it his job to bail out the kid's irresponsible parents is a tough pill to swallow.
Most of the people I care deeply about have refused to take the CC seriously, and I'm pretty sure they will come to me for help some day. Have others thought through this sort of scenario? How to you plan to handle it when the people who have refused to listen to you (or have even ridiculed you for your interest in the CC) come back looking for handouts? Erik
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My sister asked for the "Cliff Notes" when I asked her to watch the videos! Hahahaha! Maybe that's what's needed.
Anyway, I've figured out what I'm going to say if someone shows up at my door (one or all of the following):
"Grab a hoe. You're assigned 30 minutes a day in the garden."
"Help me hoist this calf - the meat's got to last us four months and I can't hang it by myself."
"The goats get milked at 4 p.m. Do you want to milk or clean the barn at 6 a.m.?"
"The chicken coops gets opened at 6 a.m., shut and the eggs brought in at 7 p.m. Can I count on you for that daily?"
"There's a huge limb down in the pond pasture; here's the ax & log cutter. Take the wheelbarrow."
Lauren
Thats one hell of a question Erik.
Personally, the majority of my preparations have more to do with providing for my daughter than they do with any vision of the future that I might entertain. As a parent, its the prudent thing to do.
But how do I deal with a friend or extended family member who dismisses this responsibility of parenthood, and fails to prepare for an unknown future? I honestly don't know.
I remember reading that during the great depression, many people sent their kids to live with friends or family members that were better off and could provide for them. Perhaps this is a reasonable solution to an unreasonable situation.
Its a thought-provoking dilemma. Thanks for the thread.
(edit: I always spell your name wrong....I fixed it....sorry about that)
Jeff
Captain Sheeple: Of the sheeple, by the sheeple, and for the sheeple.
Hi Erik,
Thats a tough question.Most of my family thinks I am a bit eccentric to say the least because I worry about what will happen. Daughter and son-in-law have the big macmansion and new cars and big tv and lots of payments. They just don't get it. I fear that they will be liviing with us in our small little house but there is no way I would turn out my daughter and grand children. I am not sure how to answer when others may want some help.
Ken
Wow Erik what a question to ask. In a way, I suppose it is quite a personal question because everyone has to deal with it when it happens in their own way.
To be smart, I imagine the way I would answer their need for help is in the same way they answer me now when I speak of future times. That is to switch the conversation quicklly to something like the weather, or some other innane benign topic! Of course I wouldn't do that but to make a point I would feel like it.
Lbart, I think you are too easy on people. Anybody needing food will be doing a full days work if they need me to give them food on my 17 acres. Although I am worried there will be more people arrive than food available....
Erik I think there is more than just money involved here ... maybe money won't be traded, or maybe there is no food to buy .... but I am a real doom and gloom merchant. I just think grow your own is the only way to go in future. But that is just me.
I will try to help everybody. And will continue to do so unless my own kids are hungry.
"We are the ones we have been waiting for"
Yes Erik, your experience of folks not listening to you sounds familiar and yes I have thought a great deal about this.
I tell myself I would turn them away with a big "I told you so!", but then once I subdue my pridefulness I admit that I would help as much as I could. Heck, most of my preparations are for numbers much larger than my wife and three little ones anyway, so the tough guy posturing is just to make myself feel better. Some of the other websites that prophecy doom and gloom, talk about shooting 'zombies' who eminate from the cities to steal food. That's fear talkin'. Or heartlessness. I think the 'zombies' would be humble and grateful and, family or not, I think that I and 'most everybody reading this would help out to the degree they could, short of endangering their own survival.
If (when) that day comes, one thing is for sure: they listen to you then!
you should probably set things up as if all the kids and grandkids will show up. but there is no free lunch, they would have to pitch in with the work.
On the bright side, there is strength in numbers.
On an even brighter side: unlike the grid down nuclear scenario, with the likely financial breakdown, there will likely be some semblance of order in society with goods being available for the right price or trade item.
Erik, honestly?
I'm going to tell them to go pound salt. They were warned, I told them exactly what would happen, and they acted like grasshoppers while this ant salted away and deferred his means to a later date. I don't see it as a pride issue. If any emotion is involved it's disgust. See, I sincerely want to get away from the sheep one way or another. I certainly wouldn't invite them in to live with me.
Prudence, not pride. You simply cannot save everyone. And you simply cannot prepare for everyone. Might I add that my plans include "cloaking" as much of my lifestyle as I can so that I don't come across as "rich" to anyone. For example, save my one brother (who is completely on-board, unemployed, but "gets it" ) the rest of my family doesn't know about my silver and gold holdings. Nor will they. They don't know about any other preparations either. Why? Well, i am 43. I know my oldest sister would be seeking institutional committment for my beliefs so i don't even bother. See, she'll be thinking that I'm just as bad off as she is. The other family members that "get it" will be putting in 12 hour workdays. No work, no eat. Myself included.
There is simply nothing that you will be able to do. If you try to "save the world" at that point then you'll be dragged down with them.
It's harsh, but if things get that bad then you'd BETTER look out for you and your family first and co-opt with family and folks that "got it" beforehand. Not converts. Hunger will make anyone agree with you until they are satiated.
I disagree with taking them in. People today do not use reason. They emote. And I sure as heck don't want people on my homestead that are going to suddenly turn my property and my belongings into a "democracy". Which is exactly what I think would happen.
If they missed the boat on the greatest socioeconomic mess in history, then what makes you think that they'll "get it" the second time around? Honestly?
The issue with kids is a tough one. But how many can you support? 5? 10? Give the parents the message from time to time. I believe it's your moral obligation and something that you CAN do. But at a certain misey level then stop. If they "ain't gettin' it at that point, then they ain't ever gettin' it". Then go incognito. Low key.
The Matrix is a system, Neo. That system is our enemy. But when you're inside, you look around, what do you see? Businessmen, teachers, lawyers, carpenters. The very minds of the people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system and that makes them our enemy. You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it.~ Morpheus
Very good and appropriate question Eric!
Yes, I'm running across the same thing on a daily basis. Our best friends who come over frequently and in which I've had numerous conversations aren't exactly in "denial", but they aren't preparing either. He and I are "gun" buddies in which we frequent the range on occasion and buy ammo, equipment, etc..for each other when we see it. She, is my wife's best friend and they see each other every day. He has taken the CC and understands the concepts but is still under the impression that the gov't will save the day. She has continuously pushed Him to buy PM's as well as to start stocking up on food. She sees that I've been right for a couple years and continue to be, so she is using common sense and saying "we need to prepare!". His comments are "We'll just head to YOUR house!" Yeah, you heard it right! He's expecting to come to MY house! She, being pretty coward by him, due to his "the man is the head of the house" attitude says the same thing. I don't think She does it because She wants to though. They have a son that has become a son to me as well so.......what to do, what to do.
As for this couple, I've prepared for them. I've put away enough food, ammo, living essentials, etc...... for them to live with us if need be. But as has been stated, they will work for their keep.
The "others" that have been warned and have done the minimal to nothing and/or have scoffed at me and my preps.....they can go to hell! I mean that with the utmost ferocity! I've warned them over and over again! I've sent them CM's reports as well as many other info that stated things were going to get tough. If they've chosen to ignore me, then they've shown a lack of respect for me IMO. They can go to hell as far as I'm concerned.
Cheers!
I honestly don't know if I'll be all that much better off than most of my family and friends. Over the past year or so my wife and I have scaled back our standard of living dramatically, exchanging a nice house for a 2 bedroom apartment and eliminating as many debts and expenses as possible. We're lucky enough to have a considerable household income now and we've been saving as much money as possible, but thus far all we've been able to do is diversify and protect our growing but modest savings and give ourselves a larger safety buffer (in the form of storable food and emergency supplies and savings). We are not in a position to buy property outright and probably won't be for another year, and while we are renting our long-term preparation options have been limited. So our ability to be in a position to help others financially or otherwise is highly subject to what happens in the next year or two. I would guess many others here are in the same boat.
Let's say I'm fortunate in being able to carry out most of my long-term preparations, and despite having a far from easy life I am in a position to help others who earlier refused to listen. If there's a way to support them without putting my family in immediate danger, I hope I'll be able to set aside my resentment and assist them. However like Lbart and Amanda, I would expect them to contribute in every way possible and not bitch (excessively anyway) about it. If over time said people proved their commitment to the household, they will be true partners of the household from that point on and have a say in how things are done (until then they'd need to follow my family's lead). And from a purely practical perspective, as long as resources are sufficient (space and food) I think I would see a long-term advantage in taking in as many hard-working people and families as resources will allow. My family is highly unlikely to be completely self-sufficient, and the more we have who can work in growing/fishing/hunting for food and doing other necessary tasks, the better off my family and everyone else will be. Lastly, if things get really ugly and security becomes a big concern, having a large household may not only increase our defensive options but also discourage some predators through size alone.
And if we're not so fortunate and have to come others to help, I will do my best to state our case that we can be an asset to the household and that pooling our resources will make us all better off. For example I have several family and friends who own their property outright, but lack a large supplly of storable food and other useful supplies that my family has been able to acquire. Plus we have skills that most of my family/friends, and come to think of it most people, lack (medical and engineering). My intention would be to form a partnership between our families, and hopefully we'd both be stronger for it. I think the majority of us here will be in this situation; we will NEED to find like-minded individuals and families with which to pool our skills and resources, because going it on our own will not be sustainable.
The more I think about it, in just about every possible scenario I think Chris has it pegged right.... community will make all the difference.
- Nickbert
"Some mornings it just doesn't seem worth it to gnaw through the leather straps." -Emo Philips
WTF is going on with the site lately? The original post was formatted as several paragraphs. Why is the whitespace all screwed up?
Erik